S12 To S13 Story Plus Clarfication Journey To Beyond.

has anyone actually physically removed a Z31 rear subframe and tried to stuff it under...oh....say an SE?  i hear they're teh same, then i hear they're different, then i hear they're the same.  who's tried it?

I think I read a thread a while ago about someone who had actually replaced his rear with z31 parts. I don't know if it went all the way to the subframe replacement though. You might be able to find that thread?

mm, some threads say its identical, some say its close.  i want to know for sure if i can bolt it in before i go thru the hassle..

i have to ask premo...why go from the s12 rear end to the z31 rear end? Especially if it is the same.

cause i have a spare one in my back yard and id like to do some modifications to my rear subframe in my SE.  but if i do i want a stock subframe to put back in in case i fuck it up.  get it?

Why not modify the Z31 one?

well, im not gona hassle with the Z31 subframe if it doesnt fit..

i can think of only one way to find out =)

yup!

Premo-S12yup!

JonB Like I said before I'm new to this whole site. But I have an 86' 200sx notch and my first was an 84' with the solid axle. The 84' is now seeming like a better design with anti-squat geometry. Any way not to digress, I within the last week went and grabbed the brake parts from a 5lug Z31. I had the salvage yard burn the rear A-arms for the hubs and whole brake assembley. The rear half seems like it will work with the stock 200sx trailing arms. The rear caliper has a wider clamp caliper for the vented disc, but is apperantly the same and will fit because it comes with a different caliper bracket that bolts to the same trail arm. I think I'll let you know soon when I assemble them. I had cut out the rubber bushing ends, on 200sx turbo rear end I grabbed for the R200 diff, and replaced them with spherical bearing ones from StockCarProducts and also boxed the rear arms. So I'm hoping I wont have to start over on the rear arms if it doesn't work.And for the rear the 89' up 2-piston caliper 300ZX looks like it will bolt to the 4-lug rotor but is wider for a vented disc and worst of all has no provisional cam for integrated parking brake. The later 300 uses a drum in the center of the disc for P-brake, this  caliper won't seem to work with the Z31 5-lug assembley with out a custom braket and custom P-brake, But for both things I'm working on Ideas. And O'h yea I think the 5-lug Z31 rear hubs will fit and are suspected by me to be the same pieces used on the V6 88' 200sx sold in the States, and most likly else where. And the the front: I first pulled just the rotor,caliper,caliper bracket, and hub off the Z31. I had to go back to the yard and get the Z31 strut/spindle assembly because unlike the rear the front required a longer caliper bracket and wasn't remidied by the differnt bracket. Also the strut housing/spindle uses a different steering arm/ball joint reciever, Just like the back, I modified the front lower control arm. For the front I couldn't find pillow-ball upper camber kits, but I think Z31 kits will work if you can find them. Also custom ones might be able to be fabricated. I thought out a seemingly good plan for that but this is what I did instead; I cut the front lower A-arm in half, ordered trailing arm bars tapped to fit 3/4" heim joints, and made braces to weld the two together. There are spacer/inserts that will fit in the heim joints that will use a 1/2" bolt. Also there are large 1/2" eccentric bolts avaible. I had my machine shop custom make brakets for the eccentrics and welded them to the front crossmember. I also purchased extra for the rear, but have yet to decide the best way to use them, Ill go back to that later. Any way I'm about to find out if the Z31 strut/steering arm assembly will fit the stock S12 4-lug balljoint, if not I'll have to go and get Z31 lower control arms and modifiy them in the same way. Also I cut the spring perches off the stock S12 strut tubes and welded a series of brackets/stops lower on the tube and slid 2" coil-over sleeves on. I'll have to modify the Z31 strut tubes in the same way befor I can get it together. And on top of all this there is another matter of getting longer outer tie-rod ends, Z31.com claims the 5-lug Z31 is 10mm wider than the 4-lug, eitherway I'm sure the stock S12 parts can give me some width safly or I can find another suitible tierod that is longer for mor aggressive front camber, If new problems are found, or the best wider tierods are found, or If the whole thing turns to a complete disaster, I'll try and let y'all know. Also there is front anti-roll, rear anti-roll, and rear camber to consider. Rear toe is adjustible from the factory, and can be increase beyond that with custom eccentric bolts and brackets. Rear anti-squat seems impossible with a trailing arm no-matter what I do. But I think rear steer suspension toe geometery problems can be completely solved by spherical bearing and rear toe adjustments. Anything else I'll write back later. Any advice/knowledge I hope ya'll write, I wanna know. Thanks; JonB

i got one

hey bart, how from from terroton idaho (hor however you spell it) are you?
im about to go there this summer to visit family

HOLA! i apologize if this has been covered earlier in the post, i dont remember seeing it anywhere, will these work the same way for the SE's? and if they do, is there any way of getting all the raw parts required to fab these up? im hoping to cut down on some time and cost (sending mine to you, you fab them, send them back) and if you are willing to send the raw parts, any chance on some simple drawings with measurments for any cuts that need to be made? im a WABO certified welder so i was hoping to assemble them myself to save some monay

do the springs only come in red?

These coilovers are way nice looking man! Keep up the good work!

Hey Bart - what the I.d. Of the spring And what length are u using? Just curious...

To me thay look like 2.5" ID and about 7" long. Probably wrong on the length, but most coilover sleeves I've seen are that diameter.

I was just thinking the same question too. For people who want to switch spring rates between different types of handling (One set of springs for street/grip another for drag or drift) so they don't have only one rate to "deal with" while doing the type of spirited driving they prefer.

Just a question. Would we be able to customize spring rates, cause i want my car stiff it doesnt bother me. i was thinking around FR: 550lb/in and R: 450lb/in

old thread with no speculative answer does Z31 subframe fit S12.
Answer is NO it hits the body. Also Noted that JonB is being long winded...sigh!! His answer has no relevance to the question. Doh!

Are you sure it wasn't the m30 rear subframe? And if it wasn't, did you make sure the subframe wasn't flipped upside down? Did you compare the Z31 and S12 one side to side?

I hope your right Mod_monstaz   i only have 1 day at my job to put it together before they tell me to move my shit.

If you need to move it, throw it outside of the shop and put it on jackstands. I can button up everything in 2 hours. I did my entire rear end, on both of my cars, on the floor.

EDIT: If anything, just swap the arms, not the subframe. I didn't have to use a Z31 subframe, but after looking at a bunch from the yards and at pictures, they look identical, where its welded and all.

trust me Randy wanted that thing to work...
So did I.

No the Z31 sub-frame does not work. it has arc that hits the body.
the Z31 control arms Bolt up to S12 direct bolt in, brakes and all.

this is what i have and how i did my 5 lug conversion in the rear.

I was looking at my old Pics of my car... yeah i never posted them
My old engine bay with CA18ET
http://s21.photobucket.com/albums/b262/fal...urrent=4c71.jpg

front mount installed with 84 turbo hood, installed


hood painted black

later car was stolen and the bump stolen with tools. car left in running condition.

Clock replacement with Gay garbage from Autozone, what the hell was i thinking.. or not.

Rb twinky install


Greddy t-Belt on RBtwinky


Z31 breaks AP brake lines / S14 brake rotors those are brand new. broke them in real good like..heheheh!


15"x6" et +35 FORD wheels on S12 after 5 lug conversion



wedsports nobody liked

 
MB Battles 17x9.5 on stretched 215/40 17's
Fender Stretched 2"s


235/40/17's replacing 215's


camber after slotting, toe in is just awfule.


new coilovers


set of 19x10's i was looking at, but i don't think wise to change bolt pattern again to 5x130 just for a set of wheels

Try to look for a set of the CCW Classics...5X114.3 available and any width/offset/size.  They are pricey but nice.

A1 can be used on both S12 and S13 conversions.

idk if i like battles on an s12 or not....

Deezusidk if i like battles on an s12 or not....

stick with 17s. good drift sizes are way cheaper

doh!

I have this swap sitting in my back yard. I need to get down on this shit.

falkhentrust me Randy wanted that thing to work...
So did I.

No the Z31 sub-frame does not work. it has arc that hits the body.
the Z31 control arms Bolt up to S12 direct bolt in, brakes and all.

this is what i have and how i did my 5 lug conversion in the rear.

Hi, Was just wondering if these are still for sale and if anyone has experience with them? Been looking into suspension for my S12 and always wanted coilovers, after reading all this it seems a better option than trying to switch everything to S13 parts for rear and front.

Any advice would be great, cheers!

bart hasnt posted in a while he has had bad rep for some time now best option is to conv the front to s13

vegasS12bart hasnt posted in a while he has had bad rep for some time now best option is to conv the front to s13

you guys realize the he hasnt posted in this thread forever right

DjayS12^what he said and then get either BC or Megan Racing coilover for the S12 as they are made for S12s with S13 front conversion. Those S12 coilover are bolt-on in the rear.