Oct 13, 2010, 6:21 am · #51
well.. it's just a style everyone. there's lovers and haters.
umm.. whatever. haha.
read before you hella flush
Oct 13, 2010, 6:48 am · #52
A good number of you guys are hating, while in fact, those in question are actually doing something with their cars. They work, they drive, and they track them. Have you considered reflecting upon your own cars and yourselves? Stop hating and start driving or something. Go collect stamps.
Stop arguing about suspension setups and go learn how to drive a car, instead of pushing around dead cars and taking photos of it (arro).
Also, henry's rears are 9J, not 10.
Heaters gonna heat.
action
Oct 13, 2010, 7:11 am · #53
werd to tha motha. we gonna press the issue on mis-matched wheels now too?
Oct 13, 2010, 7:28 am · #54
i like how it street sign reads "street street"
Oct 13, 2010, 7:36 am · #55
henrys car the second pic makes me feel like im in a video game that pic is awesome . his car has character and i personally like it. (directed at the general public) maybe its just your car is bland, watered down or just plain basic. SOME OF US like to stand out from the norm and be different henry has a good way of expressing it with both function and form. maybe some people like being the normal and boring?! i don't and judging by the way henry's car is setup neither does he. i dont understand why everybody likes knocking on someone else shit its pathetic grow up get a life and stop worrying about others and drive your cars for real sheesh. (good point deadpirate)
OFFTOPIC//// NOTCHBACK 5.0 STANGS ROCK (WILL BE A PROUD OWNER OF ONE IN THE NOT TO DISTANT FUTURE)
Oct 13, 2010, 7:39 am · #56
this degraded quickly...
cant we just agree that on the right car it looks good, but that there is no functional value to running 6~ whatever degrees of camber and that its a detriment to the handling?
besides...the argument the Japanese do it doesn't really makes sense for 2 rasons
1) camber and tire stretching was originally a european thing...
2) japan has used panty vending machines...just because they do it doesn't mean it should be done
Oct 13, 2010, 8:57 am · #57
Oct 13, 2010, 9:03 am · #58
deadpirate on 05:29:29 AM / 13-Oct-10Someone here got their panties in a bunch...must be a hellafail fanboi.
Only clubs12 would have interest in a thread as lame as this, really. No one in question is building a race car, in fact, nearly everyone here has a car that
A. doesn't run
or
B. doesn't do shit
So honestly, the majority of you guys have absolutely no business in hating. Rather, your uneducated and unvalidated comments and opinions mean nothing to anyone but yourselves.
edit: I agree with Dan, I mean to say something similar but with the whole asshole angle.
Also, Dan, cool notch. Are those AP1 s2000 wheels? lol
I run my car on dirt/gravel trails with a couple other guys here locally, so I don't see how your A and B theory really fits....
And also, this thread isn't a club-s12 conversation only, obviously SOMEONE else wrote an entire 4 page article about why it's retarded, and how you can build your car to be worth a damn instead...on a completely separate website.
I will say it looks ugly to me due to the usual camber that goes along with it. If they did it, minus camber, i'd agree with you SC that it looks alright on certain cars, but i still would rather my tire not be hidden in the fender personally on any car i'll own.
and also, /thread on SC's last lines
besides...the argument the Japanese do it doesn't really makes sense for 2 reasons
1) camber and tire stretching was originally a european thing...
2) japan has used panty vending machines...just because they do it doesn't mean it should be done
Oct 13, 2010, 10:47 am · #59
Wow this thread went good to wtf now let's all cry about it hahahaha anyway like it was previously stated who gives a rats ass everybody builds there cars for whatever they are into and and nobody should have neg comments about anothers car unless asked for an opinion I don't remember the op askin for an opinion so everyones is moo point including mine lol I don't know why everyone gets all butthurt about hellaflush if you don't like it good for you if you do godd for you too the car scene is really starting to turn into high school rich girl drama who has the best rims stance or whatever who gives a shit build your car and do you and the rest of will do us. It shouldn't matter what people think about your hence why we drive s12's and not s13 or 14's. I mean seriously let I hate this and that bullshit go.like deadpirate said go build your car or stop driving and go collect miley cyrus stickers or something. I mean seriously let this shit go......
Oct 13, 2010, 11:08 am · #60
My car is a $1500 '85 nissan. Not a 2mil BMW race car. Im goin lower.
Oct 13, 2010, 4:15 pm · #61
holy hot tub time machine,....im back in 2009.....
bloody hell..are we really still arguing about hella flush and what wheels people like, fuck you guys know there was a tsunami....and an earthquake in hati right?.....bush isnt president anymore.
man i must seem like i came from the future now!!
Oct 13, 2010, 4:21 pm · #62
CHILE MINERS RESCUED! anyways lol.
Oct 13, 2010, 4:35 pm · #63
oh yea yuta appreciates the publicity and so does henry. lol it seems cs12 cant get enough of them anyway they just wanted to say thanks!
oh and Oki Josh- your car is chill dude i like.
oh and a buddy of mine also has some input "who talks about functionality with a car that doesnt run?"
Oct 13, 2010, 5:13 pm · #64
@XANO:
what...huh...Chile...dude your from far future huh? lol.
saw that last night at a bar, cool for them!!
Oct 13, 2010, 6:38 pm · #65
The biggest issue I see in this thread that people complain about is that when lowering you get negative camber. That is true, but you do know that can be corrected? I have dropped my rear and it has been corrected. When I get my new suspension I will fine tune it so that it is virtually 0 if not 0 degrees. Randy has his 12 even lower than mine and he has perfect camber. And it is still functional in many aspects. Will he adjust his suspension when he hits the tracks next year? Yes because with his current setup and height, it works for the streets but tracking is different. Will he still have the lowered and in some ways flush/hellaflush? I have no doubt that he'll make it look good and work well. Again, it is very much the setup of your car.
Oct 13, 2010, 6:45 pm · #66
OMG - HERRA FRUSH TOPIC! teehee...
i will say this control arm is complete and total sex;
nice informed, intelligent and successful reengineering right there for sure.
now this;
is diametrically opposed to the project SE-R above.
Both are completely re engineered, refabricated and pretty much purpose built cars. Neither would function as a daily (although the sentra is alot less rediculous), both are pretty badass. I don't get VIP style any more than I get demon chamber or hell, bozozuku - but they all provide entertaining pictures Smiley
Oct 13, 2010, 7:14 pm · #67
Deezus on 04:08:22 PM / 13-Oct-10My car is a $1500 '85 nissan. Not a 2mil BMW race car. Im goin lower.
Deezus for president!!! Haha when I get home I'm puttin that I'm my sig hahahaha
Oct 13, 2010, 7:23 pm · #68
When I get my new suspension I will fine tune it so that it is virtually 0 if not 0 degrees.You're talking 0deg static chamber? Is this for looks? Im wondering what happens to the roll center, reactive toe and reactive chamber when you start from zero - If I remember correctly, the trailing arms on the S12 do some really funky ass shit like +8.2deg of chamber from level droop to the bumpstop (6.5" of travel? can't remember). Toe also gets whacked out with +4deg in the same amount of travel... I'd be interested to see what you're doing to correct all that nastyness. Cheesy
Oct 13, 2010, 8:15 pm · #69
sideways_s12 on 07:14:21 PM / 13-Oct-10Deezus for president!!! Haha when I get home I'm puttin that I'm my sig hahahaha
lol seriously. That is the only thing that bothers me about cs12. I mean i a solid supporter of doing good work. I hate when people use "oh its just an s12, 240, rx7 etc" to do shitty work. It pisses me off when people freak out over s12s and like 86 rollas.... i was at a drift event and this kid looked at a gray hatchi in the pitt and slapped his friend and was like "OMG DOOD LOOK ITS AN EIGHT SIX!" and started geekin out. I thought seriously dood... think about what your geekin about... its a fuckin 1986 toyota corolla.... i can ride my bike faster than a rolla.
I mean i love s12s, thats why i bought one. However you gatta step back and thinka bout what you have.... its an 85 S-chassis, not a Veryon. im rockin a stock KA, if my shit isnt scientifically perfect ill deal with it.
Its called meet in the middle. You know when you lets say tune a car. Boost, do you want it to come in late and make more power but have lag? or come in sooner with no lag but less power. You meet in the middle or slightly biased to one side. I want my car to look sexah. I'm not looking to outhandle BMW race cars, I'm lookin to out handle dodge neons. So if my car gives me a red rocket and still poos on neons im fucking happy.
Oct 13, 2010, 8:23 pm · #70
deadpirate on 10:29:29 AM / 13-Oct-10Only clubs12 would have interest in a thread as lame as this, really. No one in question is building a race car, in fact, nearly everyone here has a car that
A. doesn't run
or
B. doesn't do shit
So honestly, the majority of you guys have absolutely no business in hating. Rather, your uneducated and unvalidated comments and opinions mean nothing to anyone but yourselves.
Well in my case I can daily drive the car, perform at the track and turn heads, all that without hellastupid flushness. I'm not hating it, just find it stupid but I won't go beat somebody because he have a stupidly slammed ride, i'll just ignore it or keep a comment for myself. I think this thread went a bit too far since we can't get the tone things are said on the net.
Oki Josh on 10:58:31 AM / 13-Oct-10hella streched rears, hella rub, hella cut springs, hell hate all you want
If that can make you feel better, your doesn't look bad, the rear is a bit too lowered for my taste and doesn't seem to have crazy camber from this angle.. same for the stretching, can't see it from here. Your front end is a little bit to low, but nothing too crazy.. again, my opinion, your car. Your car is nowhere as exagerated as Henry's S12 or the golf I posted.
Oct 13, 2010, 8:37 pm · #71
aesthetics are firmly in the real of opinion...
Oct 13, 2010, 8:46 pm · #72
Oki Josh on 10:58:31 AM / 13-Oct-10hella streched rears, hella rub, hella cut springs, hell hate all you want
yeah, i can see the rears slightly stretched. that's f'in sweet!
I think you're ride height is lovely. what suspension you have running on the fronts and how big are your wheels/rims?
Oct 13, 2010, 8:58 pm · #73
SC S12 on 12:39:20 PM / 13-Oct-10this degraded quickly...
cant we just agree that on the right car it looks good, but that there is no functional value to running 6~ whatever degrees of camber and that its a detriment to the handling?
besides...the argument the Japanese do it doesn't really makes sense for 2 rasons
1) camber and tire stretching was originally a european thing...
2) japan has used panty vending machines...just because they do it doesn't mean it should be done
quoted for the reason that this was the original poster's (and my) point. The point that a lot of you seemed to miss. Or preferred to miss, whichever.
And Colin, my Silvia is flush. With very little gap. Flush is about side clearances, not whether you can barely stick a toothpick between the tire and fender lip.
Jphillips covers the suspension articulation issue. You can't ever run perfect zero dynamic without completely redesigning our rear suspension.
Honestly, those of you whining about "haters" and "to each his own", I'm just talking about practicality. Boso cars are not for go, they're for show.
And Yuta and Henry may or may not like the attention, but it doesn't change the fact that I frown on their camber woes. It doesn't phase me in the least that they have any thought to what I think. They're following fashion in sacrifice of function. If they're cooo with that, great. I know Henry is, he's pretty much said so himself.
But I don't hate on anyone personally. Just on their actions. And then its not hate. It's laughter. ANd maybe an eyeroll or two. But it's just my opinion. You can post what you want to on C-S12 (within the rules of course). But don't expect all of us to like it or praise what you do.
Oct 13, 2010, 9:13 pm · #74
Xano on 02:03:29 PM / 13-Oct-10Someone here got their panties in a bunch...must be a hellafail fanboi.
I run my car on dirt/gravel trails with a couple other guys here locally, so I don't see how your A and B theory really fits....
I believe that still fits under B.
Hella fail fanboy(that's precisely how you spell "boy") for life. To reiterate, you're still a silly hater with no credentials.
Oct 13, 2010, 9:36 pm · #75
@ Arro
Hella flush is when you can barley fit a toothpick. Your shit can be flush multiple ways, thats why they say its hella flush when EVERYTHING is flush not just from side to side or from top to bottom
Oct 13, 2010, 10:38 pm · #76
I'm getting sick of the bickering between you all. The best definition of flush for this whole malarky is: Having surfaces in the same plane; even.
Yes, I can look a dictionary, I don't fucking care. Don't start that argument unless you're masochistic.
And I'm sorry, when the word "Hella" is used, I think of a company that makes awesome shit that's ridiculously bright. Not as an adverb. They most certainly aren't in the wheel business. Anytime says Hella"Anything" It REALLY makes me wonder about society, and the movie idiocracy becoming a reality...
/Argument
Flush has nothing to do with: Wheel gap, toothpicks,Tires being stretched, tucked, or modified in any way
It purely involves the wheel, and tire bead, on the same plane as the fender. and at NO other angle than 180.... Flush is not 179 degrees, and it most certainly not 181 degrees. (For definition purposes)
Flush is flush. Take a straight edge and put it on the ground, is it at an adjacent angle (As in 90 degrees) and sitting FLUSH with your wheel (top AND bottom), and to your fenders unpulled straight edge? That is flush
Flush, in this whole thread, is not shown by anybodies car. I'm not flush, Hotdog isn't flush, and david has pulled his fenders so ridiculously far out there is no such thing as flush in the rear for him anymore. Colin, your's is flush in the front, but not in the rear. But yours IS a prime example of how it can be done. There is no such thing has Hellaflush, There's flush, and there's everything else. There is zero excuse for anything more than -4 degrees of camber. NONE. The trailing arm is NOT an excuse, the McPherson Strut is NOT an excuse, Being lazy and wanting it to be low is NOT an excuse. Being poor and not doing it is NOT an excuse. Any excuse is just that, an attempt to justify not doing it properly. A show/looks car shouldn't look broken, so why on earth would a car with excessive camber look good to anyone? This is completely ignoring the performance aspect altogether, because we know that side.
And before anybody goes into the whole argument of the opinion of proper, here's another definition... Proper: marked by suitability, rightness, or appropriateness
Do some google searches, what would be a suitable camber? A right camber? or an appropriate camber. Oh wait! It was posted up in the first post! No need to google!
And no, I don't fit in the A or B category either. My car's built for the track.
And that E28, while a fantastic looking paint job, and beautiful chop top. It goes against rat rod status 100% with the wheel camber. Why? Because Rat rods use solid axles, and thus have no camber. I can only hope to god he has one sturdy as hell skidpan, because if he doesn't his oil pan will be fucked on the next bump the size of a pencil. I applaud everything about that car except the rear wheels. they look terrible and broken.
And nobody here has the argument for trailing arms being the retarded red headed stepchild of fucking lucifer. The E30 has an identical setup, and is known for being the most successful road racing car. Standard versions AND M versions. The trailing arm setup works amazing for it, why can't it for you? They've managed to get the mad drop with perfect camber. It's no different than the S12...
I will most certainly not close this thread. because it will just pop up again in another shape or form. So I'd just rather keep it open and attack the sheep with my razor.
Flame suit on, I'm fairly fired up and venting anyways. None of this was aimed at any specific person, but the idea as a whole.
Oct 13, 2010, 10:58 pm · #77
I get practicality and all that also eveything jay said I understand that as well. But what exactly is practical in the car scene there are guys running stupid amouts of camber and they like it and there are guys that are running stupid amounts of hp too much to even use on the street but nobody get all but hurt about it like i said before to each their own it's their car and if they want to set it on fire they can damn well do so so why does it matter how much camber they have?
Oct 13, 2010, 11:11 pm · #78
If I had crazy camber, I wouldn't let a camera near my car. period.
I'm somewhat reluctant to take photo's of it with the wheels being different colors.
Camber can look good, don't get me wrong at all. but when it looks broken, it explains itself.
HP is different than camber really. While I agree with you 1000+ hp is stupid, but it isn't "Unsafe" all the time. Just because you have 1000 hp doesn't mean you need to use it. Camber is another story though. Kinda have no choice. It mainly irks me when people put these excessive camber things being a good looking FACT, and not a good looking opinion. And the moment someone says it has too much camber and kills it, they're instantly slated as haters and don't know anything. My opinion above is based on the facts of the words, and nothing on how the car actually is. Flush cannot mean an angle or different plane. It's that simple fact that people use so loosely that it's annoying as sin and makes me question our literacy rate.
Can you tell I'm an INTP much?
Oct 13, 2010, 11:49 pm · #79
Stock
Flush
Broke axle/"HELLAFLUSHED!!!!111OMGZ"
Post Merge: [time]11:51:58 PM / 13-Oct-10 [/time]
And yea, the flush would look better lowered 1.5" and look much better, but that would jack up my perfect camber, and that's not gonna happen.
I can't afford tires every other month.
Post Merge: 12:02:33 AM / 14-Oct-10
Oh, and the stock S12 suspension gains nearly 10 degrees neg camber when completely dropped:
That's with no spring.
Gagh. Nasty.
Oct 14, 2010, 1:54 am · #80
Except that if it were stretched across a 10" wheel it'd be "cool" lol
Oct 14, 2010, 2:03 am · #81
what are you talking about that shit right there is cool......
Oct 14, 2010, 3:09 am · #82
um... yeah.......
Oct 14, 2010, 3:17 am · #83
Deezus on 04:08:22 PM / 13-Oct-10My car is a $1500 '85 nissan. Not a 2mil BMW race car. Im goin lower.
Sig material fo sho!
Oct 14, 2010, 7:13 am · #84
Arro on 08:58:40 PM / 13-Oct-10And Colin, my Silvia is flush. With very little gap. Flush is about side clearances, not whether you can barely stick a toothpick between the tire and fender lip.
Well, I'm just asking for a picture because what I remember isnt quite fitting with what you're saying. I mean, a profile pic isnt that much to ask. Just looking for an example of what you're saying.
Oct 14, 2010, 7:41 am · #85
I like looking at hellaflush cars but i wouldnt do it myself. As formyself i wouldnt want to run too much camber and worry about tire wear for daily driving. When i had an integra and it was slammed, i change tires every year due to excessive camber. Something flush to the fender is good enough for me. I think i have a pic when i had the meisters on the rear. I gotta chrck my photobucket
Edit:
Heres a pic. Its 16x8 10 i believe i gotta double check. Tires were 225/45/16
The crown vics up front sits kinda flush already. I havent tested the meisters up front
Oct 14, 2010, 9:32 am · #86
Maxpow on 01:34:20 AM / 13-Oct-10Dunno why? Try because he hates him and makes it well known at every opportunity.
You know why, don't have to be a pussy about it.
You idiot. Look what you started. Can we get a smiley that means sarcasm?
Lol'd at how much trolling happened since I made that post. <3's to all.
Oct 14, 2010, 5:07 pm · #87
deadpirate on 09:13:48 PM / 13-Oct-10I believe that still fits under B.I really dont think a hellaflush fanboi can comment on my spelling, when you use the word hella.
Hella fail fanboy(that's precisely how you spell "boy") for life. To reiterate, you're still a silly hater with no credentials.
And also, way to pick out a picture of me when i was parked in a field at a party, went to leave driving fairly slowly and hit a mud pit.....I never said it was a super awesome offroader that could handle clay/mud up to the rims.
To quote the thread you stole my picture from. This was also before i installed my suspension and tires. Wink
Xano on 03:11:14 AM / 09-Nov-09Ahahhaha, wasn't even intentional, was trying to do a U-turn in that field, as there was no parking anywhere at this fucking place, parked in the field, went to u-turn to leave that night, got stuck.
So to reiterate, I would suggest you stop calling me a hater, because I'm struggling to find ANY pictures of you doing ANYTHING (as well as any reason why we should let you remain on this website). kthx pumpkin.
Oct 14, 2010, 5:18 pm · #88
haha I went to a car meet last night....my car was by FAR the highest one there....they were all super super slammed and hella flushed.....I dunno how they drive those things....I scrape enough as it is and Im not THAT low
Oct 14, 2010, 6:10 pm · #89
yes, this is getting good. Mods are getting mad and threatening to ban.
Don't be getting mad cause people like low cars and not cars with hellafail height
Oct 14, 2010, 7:13 pm · #90
Kustamogen on 05:18:03 PM / 14-Oct-10haha I went to a car meet last night....my car was by FAR the highest one there....they were all super super slammed and hella flushed.....I dunno how they drive those things....I scrape enough as it is and Im not THAT low
There is one thing I've noticed with our cars tho, the framerail are lower than the SE skirt lol
Oct 14, 2010, 7:38 pm · #91
looks pretty dam good right there... :thumbs:
Oct 14, 2010, 7:46 pm · #92
haha are they? Ive never really looked? I hit my exhaust on the left hand side....frame rail on the right.....been pretty good though lately about scraping ....planning my routes more carfeully in parking lots haha
Oct 14, 2010, 7:49 pm · #93
Just tired of retarded kids crying hater because i dont like EXACTLY the same things he does, and trying to use a picture of my car against me because i was stuck in the mud once. You havent seen me mad in a long time here haha. If I was mad, i wouldve just issued a warning Wink
Oct 14, 2010, 7:52 pm · #94
DjayS12 on 07:13:22 PM / 14-Oct-10There is one thing I've noticed with our cars tho, the framerail are lower than the SE skirt lol
lmao! that's true. i thought that was hilarious.
my frame rails sit almost 3 inches off the floor.
LOL LOL LOL yay!
Here's a better reference picture.. not everyone has Danimals Yogurt:
Oct 14, 2010, 8:02 pm · #95
Doodz, guess what....
Im goin lower =/
Oct 14, 2010, 9:21 pm · #96
haha for shits and giggles I checked mine
my frame rail is less than 2.5inches off that ground....definitely not going lower....maybe if I lived in a city that wasnt full of pot holes and speed bumps I would....but not here.....front lip is only about an inch off ....but thats cuz I bent the bracing for it again....grrrrrr
Oct 14, 2010, 9:35 pm · #97
lol mods aren't threatening to ban people, just deadpirate Tongue And he's apparently one of Henry's friends... or maybe even the man himself moonlights on deadpirate's account lol, after all, some o the crap that deadpirate posts is similar to what got henry banned in the first place
I'm not sayin, but I'm just sayin'...
As far as this topic goes, flush is flush like Jay said, "hellaflush" kills performance, and yes coloin, I posted pics in the first or second page of this thread already. You should look first. And by Jay's comments, even I'm not truely "flush", but I'm a hell of a lot better off than hellafrushness.
If you like the superslammed, broke-camber hellaflush style, great. Just don't try to hide from the fact that you kill your performance with it.
Framerailz... gonna go measure mine tomorrow and see, the blue car is "hella" low lol. Just doesn't look it with the 195/55-14's.
It is what it is.
AND...
I think this kind of a thread is what keeps us frm being bored when we're not working on cars or when the repair/mod funds get low Wink
Oct 14, 2010, 9:41 pm · #98
i checked mine, but didnt take a picture (cant find my camera atm, i think its behind the bar at mdgreens)....i fit a can of pop completely under my frame rail with extra space.
Oct 14, 2010, 10:10 pm · #99
@ kusta, your suspension geometry needs corrected or ban. / \ not \ /
Oct 14, 2010, 10:26 pm · #100
Arro on 03:09:29 AM / 14-Oct-10um... yeah.......
sarcasm? hope you got that lol I wasn't serious